Anthropology

» jurupari - I consider that something calls the silence.

I consider that something calls the silence. This kind of silence comes because it is necessary to forget something many traumatic. And we only can come back this narratives trhought the letters, fictionaly literature, and personal papers.

-- posted by jurupari

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» thewriteroom - I consider that something calls the silence.

Thanks, Jurupari, for your message. I agree with you, that trauma sometimes calls for and needs silence. In some cases, though, silence is imposed, when stories of persecution and suffering find no listening ear despite the teller's willingness to share it. This sort of perpetuated silence can be a dangerous breeding ground for new hatred and potential new social conflict. Finding some threads of it through the autobiographical, as you suggest, in letters, literature and or personal papers, is an excellent way to preserve these tales and to ensure that they can find some audience after all.

-- posted by thewriteroom

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» droevig_betreur - War is a parasite on all societies.

War is a parasite on all societies. We are all victimized by war. We are maimed if the war is in our neighbourhood and we are emotionally traumatized even when the war is not. Consider the three-tons of nitrates just found in Ontario.

Of course masses of Germans were victimized as were masses in all parts of Europe, Asia and North America.

The psychology of war requires that we personify an issue and learn to blame all that isn't right upon that personification. Sadam Hussein, George Bush, Jews, Arabs, homos, Left, Right …. In determining who is right and who is wrong, we divide right and wrong in neat piles on each side of the line dividing right and wrong—bad and good.

History isn’t written until there is a victor. Had the Germans won, there would have been no end to the stories of atrocities heaped upon humanity by the Axis. Unfortunately, for the Germans, Hitler inflated a flagging pride by vilifying Jews, queers and the mentally infirm. Hitler inflated German pride until it became megalomania. The victors’ remedy was to annihilate and transform that condition. To this day, anytime the Germans start to feel right about themselves, there is an unending line of people who are all too ready to remind the Germans and their corporations of forced slavery etc.

Should we talk openly about the trauma experienced by the German people? You betcha! Should we examine how it is that national pride can turn into national megalomania? We really need to discuss that. Fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims have given us a wake-up call.

Dutch social scientist Henk Houweling says, “one of the causes of war is war itself.” We are living in the midst of a world war right now. As wars are being fought, new ones are being planned. Part of the current state of affairs might be linked to the fact that we haven’t fully discussed what the hell went on in Germany. We haven’t taken the time to realize that the German people are people no different than you or I. We run on the same physiological system, our brains are the same and we respond to the same motivators. What happened to the German people could happen right here in North America.

-- posted by droevig_betreur

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» thewriteroom - War is a parasite on all societies.

In response to War is a parasite on all societies. posted by droevig_betreur:

Thanks for your message- I could not agree with you more. You are really onto something when you say that our tendency to "personify" or "categorize" all that is not right is a dangerous one. The work of British social scientist Norbert Elias comes to mind- the maintenance of "in" and "out" groups can, and usually does, turn around for the worse. There's no easy answer- as you say, our need to divide who's right and who's wrong (who's "us" and who's "them") is part and parcel of the kind of creatures we are.

Having said that, I think that personal, autobiographical narratives can disrupt those "neat piles on each side of that line" [between right and wrong]. Personal memories and autobiographical stories can function as a link between personal and collective memory and have the potential to pierce through ready-made and rigid categories of right and wrong.

-- posted by thewriteroom

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» jurupari - I consider that something calls the silence.

How do you see the relation between a person who suffer the violence and a person who gives violence? I believe that only re-doing the receiver's violence route we can be understand how was his relations, mediations, acceptances and refusals.

-- posted by jurupari

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» droevig_betreur - Classical Conditioning

In response to I consider that something calls the silence. posted by jurupari:

Jurupari, I'll answer your question with a question: What effect does the Stockholm syndrome have on people who are held hostage by beliefs? There may be a close identification between victim and perpetrator if the act isn't random and momentary.

Recounting horror can be traumatizing for both the victim and purpetrator. In war time the "villian" is dehumanized. Villians are no longer people they are things--japs, huns, gooks, honkies, niggers. When we dehumanize a person, we are given licence to treat them or mistreat to the level at which we value them. Wisdom has it that if taken hostage, you are in greater peril of death once a hood is placed over your head.

Classical conditioning uses "extinction" as a method to help patients overcome behaviours associated with past trauma. Talking about the horrors and feelings is a major part of extinction. Storytelling has restorative properties for the victim and the perpetrator. I say the perpetrator because as a human, I may view you as a human today; war-type thinking may make me view you in a way that leads to dehumanization; when the war-time fades and my thinking rebalances, I may again think of you as a human. What then do I think of myself? What demons must I then suppress?

For the rest of us, the storytelling is a learning experience where we have the opportunity to identify the beginnings of dangerous thinking and perhaps avoid repeating history.

-- posted by droevig_betreur

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» jurupari - Classical Conditioning

Thanks to answer my question. In fact, I know you are right, but when I did that question I was point out to writeroom and my intention was something in the methodological space. However, you gave answer to me in another foccus which it was good too. Thanks

-- posted by jurupari

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» gickerman - I consider that something calls the silence.

In response to I consider that something calls the silence. posted by thewriteroom:

See the way when we talk about things like war, crime, slavery and bad gear in general. We try to be so piggin civilized that we cant be seen to blame anyone. Maybe if we just said these people were wrong and drew bolts from the Gods down on themselves.Any one could feel for them then as we've all known moments when we were due a doom and escaped it.

-- posted by gickerman

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds